TOPIC:

Hi,

I have some questions concerning rebuild and start-up the engine. I`m gone install new pistons and rings in a new bored cylinders. And I will not be able to start up the engine for before 2-3 moths later and the bike is stored outside under roof (32℉ - 41℉), I`m planning to use a lot of oil on the cylinder walls and pistons rings when I reassembly.

1. Is these any problem or something I need to know?

2. When I start up first time, is there something special I shall do ?

3. I have tired to search for a burn-in procedure, but haven't found any?


Background:
750 bored up to 810 and overhauled the valves.

This is from an old thread. The information is from a respected KZ engine builder.

Break in Procedure

Andy, this is a present Larry and Plum gave me back in 2008.... Follow it to the T, don't cut corners and you as well will be golden...

With everything in place, Cam Degreeing, initial carb jetting, ignition timing etc... This is all going to change a tad on ya so don't go crazy trying to jet & sync quite just yet...


Sent: Tuesday, December 30, 2008 5:06 PM
Subject: Re: Start up Do's and Don'ts


If you want and if you can get it locally, Joe Gibbs Break In oil is excellent stuff. Make sure it's the break in oil and not one of the synthetic blends. They have many blends of Joe Gibbs.

BEFORE YOU BOLT ON THE VALVE COVER TO FIRE UP THE MOTOR....go to the auto parts store and get yourself a bottle of LL2 lifter lube. It's additive to protect the new cams. Web gives you some l-lube with them but I like to really gob it on the lobes and buckets on a fresh motor with NEW cams.

DO NOT LET THE MOTOR IDLE FOR THE FIRST 30 MINUTES OF OPERATION.

Change oil and filter in 100 miles. No more lifter lube will be needed at that point, just regular, good oil. Kendall 10 -40 has served me well over the years.

Here's what I do on a new motor and have great results.

When you assemble the head nuts and washer, use NAPA Engine Assembly Grease on the washers & the Nut Threads. Torque to spec. [use it on the cam bolts too]

Then fire up the motor and run it above 2500RPM for maybe 5 minutes with a fan blowing on the engine. You want plenty of air so you don't blue the new pipe. Then shut it off and let it cool completely down to stone cold. [even if that's overnight sitting].

Then before firing it up again, set your torque wrench to spec and go over the head nuts one more time. They will probably take some torque. Since you lubed the threads and washers and did not run the engine an extreme long time, you won't have to break each one loose again to re-torque.

Then, you're ready to hit the road and have some fun. Remember...keep the RPM above 2500 for a while yet. Go ride the bike, vary the RPM, DO NOT CRUISE AT STEADY THROTTLE OPENINGS. Don't baby it either. After it's warmed up good, run it up there to 6000 in 3rd gear. You'll feel the new power taunting you to pull the trigger!

Another thing MAKE ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN there are no fingerprints on the chrome pipe when you fire the motor....they'll burn in and stay for ever...

Basically repeat the procedure up to 500 miles do a full service...oil & filter, valve adjustment, carb synch, check ignition timing, check then again at 1500 miles... Check engine mount bolts, frame bolts, engine case bolts etc.... for they will loosen on ya.

You follow this advice and you'll love what that old girl will now and and later on do for ya...

Translation: Pull the trigger (twist her) and you better be holding on for she's going to take off on ya like a raped ape....

OMR

After you get some miles on it an do a full service...oil & filter, valve adjustment, carb synch, check ignition timing....try to shoot for .004" on intake and .004" - .006" on exhaust. You want the exhaust a thou or two looser than the intakes.

How to "break in" an engine is almost as controversial as "what oil should I use."

From what you say, I'd be a little concerned about leaving a fresh bore job outside in the cold. I don't like to use a lot of oil on the cylinder walls or piston rings. Can you wait until it's warmer to install the top end? If so, I'd wait. You don't need to use assembly lube for what you are doing either. Just pour motor oil over the cams before installing the valve cover, and be sure to coat the cylinder walls with a light coat of motor oil.

Upon the first start I adjust the idle up and then check vacuum sync. Use a fan in front of the engine. After that set the idle back down to normal and take the bike out on the road and run it like you would driving around the city. Start and stop, accelerate up through the gears but no redline right away, vary the engine speed and throttle setting. The worst thing you can do is drive too easy since that can lead to the rings not seating properly. After 30 miles or so of this kind of riding then you can start to use more throttle and rpm's. By 75 miles I'm running full throttle and taking the rpm's up to redline briefly. In other words, just ride the bike normally (for most of us anyway).


Oh, and be sure to retorque the cylinder head at 20 miles and again at 50. If the 50 check shows the nuts are all tight then no need to do it again until you get a few thousand miles on the bike. To torque the nuts you need to back them off about 1/8 turn before making them tight again. It's a good idea to check the valve clearance each time you pull the valve cover too until you are confident, like the head nuts, that everything is stable and not changing.

Nessism wrote: How to "break in" an engine is almost as controversial as "what oil should I use."

From what you say, I'd be a little concerned about leaving a fresh bore job outside in the cold. I don't like to use a lot of oil on the cylinder walls or piston rings. Can you wait until it's warmer to install the top end? If so, I'd wait. You don't need to use assembly lube for what you are doing either. Just pour motor oil over the cams before installing the valve cover, and be sure to coat the cylinder walls with a light coat of motor oil.

Upon the first start I adjust the idle up and then check vacuum sync. Use a fan in front of the engine. After that set the idle back down to normal and take the bike out on the road and run it like you would driving around the city. Start and stop, accelerate up through the gears but no redline right away, vary the engine speed and throttle setting. The worst thing you can do is drive too easy since that can lead to the rings not seating properly. After 30 miles or so of this kind of riding then you can start to use more throttle and rpm's. By 75 miles I'm running full throttle and taking the rpm's up to redline briefly. In other words, just ride the bike normally (for most of us anyway).


Oh, and be sure to retorque the cylinder head at 20 miles and again at 50. If the 50 check shows the nuts are all tight then no need to do it again until you get a few thousand miles on the bike. To torque the nuts you need to back them off about 1/8 turn before making them tight again. It's a good idea to check the valve clearance each time you pull the valve cover too until you are confident, like the head nuts, that everything is stable and not changing.

Thank you for feedback, sorry slow replay, but the side was down yesterday.

What I can do is to reassemble the whole engine and paint it, and then store the engine inside in heated room, and install it into the frame when it gets warmer, And then can I rebuild the rest of the bike in the meantime. What temp is good, when the temperature not drop under 32 degrees Fahrenheit? I can also wait until I can start using the bike, but I wold like to discover if something is wrong also

When I reassembly the top end I was thinking insert all four piston into the cylinders and then lower the block slow and mount the piston pin/bolt at one and one piston, is there a way of doing it when you only have to hands?

Again, thank you.

This is about how I broke mine in..... I used a fair amount of assembly lube and STP on the cams and lifter because I replaced them with the slightly hotter 750 cams and like Ness says might not be needed. I also pulled the plugs and did a quick comp check on each before starting and this built oil pressure so it didn't start dry. On the #4 cyl the pressure light went off. Good to hear you're going to oil the cyl and pistons up good....... I've read a few put em in dry or with a few drops of automatic trans fluid to break em in quicker and that makes me shutter thinking about things scraping till pressure builds.

Maybe You could wait till its around 50-60 degree's out and use a heating blanket over night or a small space heater (like I did for a hour and a half) to get the motor warmed up a little before firing. I let it idle at 2,300 for 4-5 min then took it out for a ride of 45-50 miles just like the guys said (not being to easy but not to hard on it) ( 4 or 5, 3rd and 4th gear pulls to 6,000 with a easy mile after to cool things down after each time ......then letting it cool over night and re checking the head bolts.... then once more at 600. Checked the cam clearance at 100 and 600 miles.

Some guys do the pistons your way I installed em all and had the 2/3 pistons up high and put them on first then 1/4 using my fingers to compress the rings...... (recommended by Jay at APE and worked great for me) ..... some use homemade ring compressers out of clamps and pop cans. Try to search for that.... used to be a fair amount of info I found on the subject.

When your machinist guy bores the cylinders be sure to tell him to cut a new chamfer on the bottom of the cylinder like original to aid piston/ring install.

Regarding getting the pistons installed into the cylinder, that's a somewhat difficult job that requires extreme caution if you are not experienced. I strongly recommend some piston ring compressors. You can make your own set for cheap using sheet metal and large hose clamps. There are quite a number of people that damage rings during install inside the cylinder so be very careful.

Personally, I've never tried to install the pistons into the cylinder first so I can't offer any advice.

One very nifty setup I saw to hold up the cylinder during install involved hanging the cylinder by rope, with elastic straps on the end of the rope. The cylinder was hung under its own weight in just the right position over the rods, and then just light effort was need to pull down the cylinder by stretching the straps to get the pistons installed in the bores. This worked well to install the cylinder with only one person.

Good luck.

I will try to make a good plan before I start

But here are no problem assembly the engine and store in a heated room for some months and then install it in the frame and start up?

Nessism wrote: How to "break in" an engine is almost as controversial as "what oil should I use."

From what you say, I'd be a little concerned about leaving a fresh bore job outside in the cold. I don't like to use a lot of oil on the cylinder walls or piston rings. Can you wait until it's warmer to install the top end? If so, I'd wait. You don't need to use assembly lube for what you are doing either. Just pour motor oil over the cams before installing the valve cover, and be sure to coat the cylinder walls with a light coat of motor oil.

Upon the first start I adjust the idle up and then check vacuum sync. Use a fan in front of the engine. After that set the idle back down to normal and take the bike out on the road and run it like you would driving around the city. Start and stop, accelerate up through the gears but no redline right away, vary the engine speed and throttle setting. The worst thing you can do is drive too easy since that can lead to the rings not seating properly. After 30 miles or so of this kind of riding then you can start to use more throttle and rpm's. By 75 miles I'm running full throttle and taking the rpm's up to redline briefly. In other words, just ride the bike normally (for most of us anyway).


Oh, and be sure to retorque the cylinder head at 20 miles and again at 50. If the 50 check shows the nuts are all tight then no need to do it again until you get a few thousand miles on the bike. To torque the nuts you need to back them off about 1/8 turn before making them tight again. It's a good idea to check the valve clearance each time you pull the valve cover too until you are confident, like the head nuts, that everything is stable and not changing.

When do you recommend to replace oil and oil-filter first time after start-up ?

I assume I change the oil and oil-filter second time within normal maintenance intervals?

I would be wary of leaving the motor built for a few months before firing it up for the first time, (and any other time) Oil never stops flowing and there is a risk of all the oil leaving your bearings/piston walls/cams/etc pretty dry for that first fire-up. I am going to be building a new motor soon and I will try to finish assembly right before I am ready to fire her up to make sure all the oil I put in is still on all the surfaces. I have heard that just a couple of revolutions for the main bearings running dry can ruin them.
My 0.02

What is the different between letting the engine stand the whole winter (5-6 months) and not starting up and starting up 2 moth after rebuild?
I have only rebuild the engine from the top.

I was planning to running the engine on the start motor without having plugs installed to move oil around before I actual start up ?

I can't see any difference if you've used assembly lube on the cams and fresh oil in the crankcase.
I would probably pour a small amount of oil into the bores and kick it over a few times before starting the motor up if you've left it sitting several months.

Top end break in needs pure mineral oil and some decent RPM variation to seat the rings under pressure without glazing the bores, don't try redlining it.
If you're not changing the bearing shells, you don't have to worry about babying the motor too much.

Lastly, shop manual torque specs are for dry/unlubricated threads.

weeZee wrote: I can't see any difference if you've used assembly lube on the cams and fresh oil in the crankcase.
I would probably pour a small amount of oil into the bores and kick it over a few times before starting the motor up if you've left it sitting several months.

Top end break in needs pure mineral oil and some decent RPM variation to seat the rings under pressure without glazing the bores, don't try redlining it.
If you're not changing the bearing shells, you don't have to worry about babying the motor too much.

Lastly, shop manual torque specs are for dry/unlubricated threads.

1.
So it`s essential to use assembly lube on the cams?
It`s not good enough use new mineral oil?

2.
So when I start up I shall drive a tour without any carb sync? When I sync the time goes.... 30 -45 minutes ?
So not to glazing, just take the bike on a tour and use different RPM?

3.
Torque, what do you mean? I need to torque up the bolts according to speck from Kawasaki?

4.
When should I replace oil and filter the first time?