Confused. Regulato/Rectifier combo vs. OEM separate Reg/Rec on a KZ650

650Dude wrote: On top of that, I have NEVER seen a rectifier like this:

That is how all old rectifiers used to look. They are typically selenium rectifiers within the cooling fins. Even industrial rectifiers looked like that (which is probably what Japanese bike manufacturers originally used). You can find rectifiers like that in a lot of old Japanese electronics from the 60's and early 70's.

loudhvx wrote: This is what matters on your Kz650. These three screws.

Those screws mean you have an excited-field type alternator.

Thanks for this info. Its good to know I have the best charging system of the lot. That was valuable info you passed along.

However, I have a VERY specific question which has yet to be answered.:

Given the pics I have posted, my question is will the rectifier regulator combo I have ALREADY purchased below, work with my system, and WILL IT MAKE the voltage regulator obsolete, and if so what do I do with the wires coming out of the Voltage Regulator pictured below

This is what I bought:



Im concerned about what to do with this if the NEW unit I have has made this obsolete

:

...will the rectifier regulator combo I have ALREADY purchased below, work with my system...

No.

Notice it only has two yellow wires.
The green wire makes it likely for Honda applications.

Yes, your regulator has a green wire. That green wire is very different from the green wire on the reg/rec you purchased. Honda uses that green wire as a ground. Your bike uses the green wire as a regulated positive-power for the field coil.

loudhvx wrote: No.

When you say "no" I dont know which post your referring to because you didnt "quote" the post.

So, I will assume youre saying the reg/rec combo I have WILL NOT make the voltage regulator obsolete.

In that case, then I may ALSO have to buy a VOLTAGE regulator to replace the old one right? Correct me if Im wrong.

I was answering the "very specific question" you had. But I edited my post to elaborate.

Return it if you can. If not, you may be able to sell it to someone with a 78 or 79 Kz650.

You may want to read up on excited-field type alternators as implemented by Kawasaki because I see you also have a 77 Kz750 twin. It uses a fully electronic version similar to your 650, but the difference is that your 650 uses a mechanical regulator.

It is essentially a car-type alternator, but it doesn't use brushes or slip rings which often fail on car alternators. Kawasaki's system is quite ingenious, but also quite expensive, which is probably why they eventually got rid of it. Some hondas use a similar system, but their field-coils fail miserably (I know you may have some Hondas sitting around in the garage).

There are many pages on Kzrider that elaborate the differences and similarities between your two charging systems. Hopefully they have not been deleted.

loudhvx wrote: I was answering the "very specific question" you had. But I edited my post to elaborate.

Return it if you can. If not, you may be able to sell it to someone with a 78 or 79 Kz650.

I had a very detailed conversation with a tech at Ricks before ordering this. Its advertised on their page as fitting Kawas specifically. I will give them a call and let you know what they say, based on your info. Also, I am able to return it.

OK. Your bike is a 1977 KZ650-B1. Given that, its voltage regulator and rectifier are two separate units. The charging system in a 3 phase excited filed system. My opinion is that it is the best of the various KZ650 charging systems. It is very likely that only one of the two components is faulty, so I would urge you to perform some simple tests to determine which unit is faulty. The tests are described in the Kawasaki Service Manual. If you do not own the manual see the first link below for an electronic copy. My 1977 KZ650-C1 uses the exact same charging system. Several years ago the rectifier in my system failed, and the tests described in the manual pinpointed the failure. I replaced the rectifier with one from Oregon Motorcycle Parts (second link below), and the new unit still works perfectly. If you have questions regarding the parts the folks at Oregon Motorcycle Parts are happy and very qualified to answer them. Ed

www.kzrider.com/modules/ServiceManuals/K...Service%20Manual.pdf

www.oregonmotorcycleparts.com/Products.html

I added some info on my last post.

Ed, based on his other topic, I assume his regulator may be getting long-in-the-tooth if not outright damaged by water etc.

And I wouldn't trust any tech lines, unless they are answered by the owner or main engineer of the company. That is likely the case at OregonMotorcycleParts.

loudhvx wrote: I was answering the "very specific question" you had. But I edited my post to elaborate.

Return it if you can. If not, you may be able to sell it to someone with a 78 or 79 Kz650.

You may want to read up on excited-field type alternators as implemented by Kawasaki because I see you also have a 77 Kz750 twin. It uses a fully electronic version similar to your 650, but the difference is that your 650 uses a mechanical regulator.

It is essentially a car-type alternator, but it doesn't use brushes or slip rings which often fail on car alternators. Kawasaki's system is quite ingenious, but also quite expensive, which is probably why they eventually got rid of it. Some hondas use a similar system, but their field-coils fail miserably.

There are many pages on Kzrider that elaborate the differences and similarities between your two charging systems. Hopefully they have not been deleted.

This is for sale on ebay. It is off a 77 Kawa and looks exactly like the RIcks one I bought. I have no intention of buying it, just showing you it has the very same wire configuration as the new one I have. So im not understanding how you came to the conclusion the Ricks one wont work. Not challenging you, just asking. Ricks are known for knowing "their stuff" and I spoke with them before buying this:

The listing is wrong. That one is probably from a 78 model built in 1977. The seller is likely only looking at the neck sticker on the frame for the build date. Notice, again, two yellow wires... very simple to rule it out. It will not work on your bike. That is why I mentioned you might sell your new one to a 78 or 79 owner.

Ebay is not a good source of information.

A better source is the service manual. It usually has a good detailed description of the charging systems.

Also, there have been hundreds of Kz650 charging system posts over the last 18 years on Kzrider. This thread is a repeat of about 50 or so of them.

loudhvx wrote: The listing is wrong. That one is probably from a 78 model built in 1977. The seller is likely only looking at the neck sticker on the frame for the build date. Notice, again, two yellow wires. Very simple to rule it out. It will not work on your bike. That is why I mentioned you might sell your new one to a 78 or 79 owner.

Ebay is not a good source of information.

This will probably sound terrible, but Rick's is staffed by mostly women. I had a very long convo with a woman tech before buying this and I was not confident she knew what I was talking about. Seems like my instincts were right.

Anyways. as you and Ed suggested, Ive reached out to Oregon Parts and will buy from them what I need.

650ed wrote: OK. Your bike is a 1977 KZ650-B1. Given that, its voltage regulator and rectifier are two separate units. The charging system in a 3 phase excited filed system. My opinion is that it is the best of the various KZ650 charging systems. It is very likely that only one of the two components is faulty, so I would urge you to perform some simple tests to determine which unit is faulty. The tests are described in the Kawasaki Service Manual. If you do not own the manual see the first link below for an electronic copy. My 1977 KZ650-C1 uses the exact same charging system. Several years ago the rectifier in my system failed, and the tests described in the manual pinpointed the failure. I replaced the rectifier with one from Oregon Motorcycle Parts (second link below), and the new unit still works perfectly. If you have questions regarding the parts the folks at Oregon Motorcycle Parts are happy and very qualified to answer them. Ed

www.kzrider.com/modules/ServiceManuals/K...Service%20Manual.pdf

www.oregonmotorcycleparts.com/Products.html

Thanks for this Ed. The rectifier is shot. Tested it. Im also getting a new voltage regulator just because. As you suggested, I am ordering it from Oregon. Thanks for the suggestion. Slightly annoyed that the women techs over at Ricks completely wasted my time.