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TOPIC: KZ1000P charging system output?

KZ1000P charging system output? 10 Jan 2013 14:45 #566707

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I am trying to find the specs on the KZ1000P (police) charging system for possible adaptation to another bike. I have not found any definitive information. I need to know how many amps it is rated at as compared to the stock bike. The parts diagrams I've looked at call for a different part number, so I am presuming there is a difference.

This information should be found in a service manual.

Thanks.
1981 Suzuki GS1000G

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KZ1000P charging system output? 10 Jan 2013 15:01 #566709

  • MFolks
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I believe the charging system is the same for all the "J" engined bikes; three phase A.C., 20 amps at 8000 rpm,the voltage regulator is the short circuit type. www.electrosport.com sells higher output stators and regulator/rectifiers too.

Alternator Testing For the Older 4’s(Z1’s,Kz 900’s, Kz1000’s,Kz1100’s ,GPz1100’s
And possibly the 750’s).

To check to see if the alternator is working you need to follow these simple steps:

1. Fully charge the battery as this will be the power source during this test.

2. Disconnect the Regulator/Rectifier at the plug that has the six wires in it.

3. Start the engine and let it warm to operating temperature.

4. If you're worried about overheating, position a large fan for cooling the engine.

5. After the engine has reached operating temperature, have a helper assist you, and using a multi-meter, read the output at the three yellow wires (or the alternator output wires)at the disconnected connector.

6. Raise the engine speed to 4000 rpm, and see what the three YELLOW wire combinations(or any alternator output wires) are(1-3, 2-3 & 1-2). The output will be around 50 Volts A.C.(Alternating Current). BE CAREFUL, AS THERE IS A SHOCK HAZARD HERE!! The Alternator produces a three(3) phase A.C. power that is changed to D.C. by the regulator/rectifier, powering the motorcycles electrical system.

7. If any of the combinations are low or non-existent, the stator(wire windings) are bad and must be replaced. Some of the older Z1’s and KZ900’s were reported to be phase sensitive, so check the wire colors carefully.

8. Using an OHMETER, Check the three wire combinations again, looking for a reading of 0.36 - 0.54 OHMS. If the readings are above or below, the stator may be bad and need replacement. Also check from any of the three YELLOW wires to ground, this will show if arcing took place. Check only with the engine off !!

9. Before ordering a new stator, check the connections from the stator as there are electrical "Bullet" connectors that may be damaged or dirty. Inspect the wiring for signs of shorting or overheating too. www.z1enterprises.com sells replacement rubber grommets for the alternator output wiring, they get hard and could leak oil after a while.

10. Check the wiring coming out of the grommet as there have been situations where the wires were damaged causing a short(I.E. twisted together with insulation damage).

11. The sprocket cover will have to be removed to access the electrical connectors coming from the alternator, the left foot peg assembly and shifting lever will have to come off also.
1982 GPZ1100 B2
General Dynamics/Convair 1983-1993
GLCM BGM-109 Tomahawk, AGM-129A Advanced Cruise Missile (ACM)
The following user(s) said Thank You: GPz550D1

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KZ1000P charging system output? 10 Jan 2013 15:32 #566713

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Thanks. I'm trying to emulate your GPZ1100 (fuel injection) on a GS1000. I'm hoping someone with a KZ1000P shop manual will read this and see what the specs say. My GS1000 is rated at 19A according to the shop manual, and the fellow at the stator place (Rick's Electric) said there is no room to rewind it for more power. The fuel pump is my main concern right now. It is difficult to find one that can be operated by pulse width that does not draw more than 5 amps.
1981 Suzuki GS1000G

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KZ1000P charging system output? 10 Jan 2013 16:21 #566722

  • MFolks
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Maybe someone here can help: www.msefi.com Or here:
Fuel Pumps & Regulators
www.fuel-pumps.net/gsl393.html
www.mpsracing.com/products/MPS/FuelPumps.asp
www.airtexproducts.com/
www.summitracing.com/parts/msd-2225?part=msd-2225

To make the FI system work on a Suzuki, I'd think you'll need:
1. A computer(shock mounted).
2. Fuel lines rated at 35 PSI minimum.
3. Fuel pump.
4. Fuel filter.
5. One way return line to the tank.
6. Fuel pressure regulator
7. Heat insulated fuel injectors(the 1981 GPz's cooked the injectors, in the 82's they were insulated better).
8. Related wiring.
9. A manifold supplying the injectors with pressurized fuel.
10. Some way to measure the throttle opening for the computer to adjust fuel flow/pressure.

On my bike,idle fuel pressure is 33 PSI, as soon as the throttle is opened, it goes to 35 PSI. The stock pump can go up to 70 PSI, but finding fuel lines that are small in size at that higher pressure can be hard to do.
1982 GPZ1100 B2
General Dynamics/Convair 1983-1993
GLCM BGM-109 Tomahawk, AGM-129A Advanced Cruise Missile (ACM)
The following user(s) said Thank You: GPz550D1

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KZ1000P charging system output? 10 Jan 2013 17:26 #566730

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Am there, doing that ( click for GS Resources project thread ):

To make the FI system work on a Suzuki, I'd think you'll need:
1. A computer(shock mounted). Using a Microsquirt
2. Fuel lines rated at 35 PSI minimum. Have designed for 6AN lines & filter past the pump, will likely use 43 PSI
3. Fuel pump. ??? Still working on that one
4. Fuel filter. See above
5. One way return line to the tank. Not needed, using pulse width modulation (PWM) system with a pressure sensor in the rail. This is the same system modern vehicles use. It slows/stops the pump as needed based on pressure. Fuel is not excessively heated and the pump (must be turbine design) does not have to work as hard= lower amps.


6. Fuel pressure regulator Not needed, see above
7. Heat insulated fuel injectors(the 1981 GPz's cooked the injectors, in the 82's they were insulated better). Not known to be a factor, using popular GSXR600 throttle bodies & injectors
8. Related wiring. Have designed several harnesses & upgraded Bussmann fuse panel, working on PWM system today
9. A manifold supplying the injectors with pressurized fuel. See GSXR600 above
10. Some way to measure the throttle opening for the computer to adjust fuel flow/pressure. GSXR TB has built-in throttle position sensor that will work with the Microsquirt.

I'll add a few more specific to the Microsquirt:
11. Misc. sensors such as oxygen, MAP, intake air temp, and cylinder head (coolant) temp.


On my bike,idle fuel pressure is 33 PSI, as soon as the throttle is opened, it goes to 35 PSI. The stock pump can go up to 70 PSI, but finding fuel lines that are small in size at that higher pressure can be hard to do.


Thanks for the fuel pressure details. The Kawasaki 1100 fuel pump is popular for doing this, but I don't think it will work with PWM.
1981 Suzuki GS1000G

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KZ1000P charging system output? 10 Jan 2013 22:06 #566773

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You can lower the AMPs used by some of your existing electrics. Convert to LED lights, brake/ tail, Turn, dash etc. That should get you back several of those Watts/ Amps.
Changing charging systems for a 1 amp gain seems kinda useless. The Police Bike will be 20 Amp output like MFolks posted. It will make that at a much lower RPM than the book shows. I've tested output, 20 AMps at 2K RPM.
1982 KZ1000LTD K2 Vance & Hines 4-1 ACCEL COILS Added Vetter fairing & Bags. FOX Racing rear Shocks, Braced Swing-arm, Fork Brace, Progressive Fork Springs RT Gold Emulators, APE Valve Springs, 1166 Big Bore kit, RS34's, GPZ cams.
1980 KZ550LTD C1 Stock SOLD Miss it
1979 MAZDA RX7 in the works, 13B...

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KZ1000P charging system output? 10 Jan 2013 22:36 #566781

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I'm planning on LEDs, forgot to add those above.

I would not change the system for 1 amp. Thanks for the actual info. There is a lot of speculation as to the output which was why I came here to find out from someone that knew the answer.
1981 Suzuki GS1000G

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KZ1000P charging system output? 10 Jan 2013 22:50 #566783

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Yep, LEDs would help
If you did the KZ1000 conversion, would you be able to fit the high output Stator from Ricks?
ricksmotorsportelectrics.com/proddetail....YXdLWjEwMDBQUG9saWNl
You would have to find out the output rating, as I don't see it listed.
1982 KZ1000LTD K2 Vance & Hines 4-1 ACCEL COILS Added Vetter fairing & Bags. FOX Racing rear Shocks, Braced Swing-arm, Fork Brace, Progressive Fork Springs RT Gold Emulators, APE Valve Springs, 1166 Big Bore kit, RS34's, GPZ cams.
1980 KZ550LTD C1 Stock SOLD Miss it
1979 MAZDA RX7 in the works, 13B...

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KZ1000P charging system output? 11 Jan 2013 02:14 #566811

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I have a Rick's stator in the GS now (along with a great Compu-fire series regulator/rectifier). I had emailed them & they were the ones that told me there was no more room to rewind it for higher output. The claims Electropsort makes is 20% more, which would be a decent 24 amps if true.

I also asked about putting a KZ stator in a GS, and they referred me to a forum... :laugh:

I see Ricks gives no numbers for that part, so it's a huge risk of $160 in my book.

I have sent in a "request for quote" at a flight place that sells micro pumps for fuel injection. Some draw as little as 20 Ma but do not flow enough fuel. What I want to do exists, it is just a matter of finding it and being able to afford it.
1981 Suzuki GS1000G

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KZ1000P charging system output? 11 Jan 2013 10:00 #566828

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The 80 KZ1000 G was injected, along with the GPZs. The early GPZ 1100 is the same air cooled "J" series motor as the police bike, for the charging system. Those ran on the 20 amp output just fine. Might not have a lot of extra for accessories, but they did have additional wires for just that.
Try making a list of your electrical system use, add up the current use of the parts. See how close you get to the Max Out Put.
1982 KZ1000LTD K2 Vance & Hines 4-1 ACCEL COILS Added Vetter fairing & Bags. FOX Racing rear Shocks, Braced Swing-arm, Fork Brace, Progressive Fork Springs RT Gold Emulators, APE Valve Springs, 1166 Big Bore kit, RS34's, GPZ cams.
1980 KZ550LTD C1 Stock SOLD Miss it
1979 MAZDA RX7 in the works, 13B...

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KZ1000P charging system output? 11 Jan 2013 11:06 #566837

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That has also been done (worst case @ 14V, some of this is an estimate):
High beam: 4.29A
Heated gloves (seasonal): 1.57A
Ignition: 5A (2 coils @ 3 ohms)
LED bulbs (all): .34A
Phone charger: .1A
Added gauges: .26A
Microsquirt: 1A
Fuel pump: 4A
Heated O2 sensor (after warmup): .54A
Pressure control: .1A
Injectors (4): 4.16A
Total: 21.36A

Without the gloves, it should work OK. Another GS member has done this to his 1100 and reports no problems using a 5A pump.
1981 Suzuki GS1000G

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KZ1000P charging system output? 11 Jan 2013 11:18 #566841

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I see your in Florida, so heated gloves wouldn't be needed much if at all. Looks like a nice fairing on the front, which would almost eliminate any wind on the hands. I have a Vetter on my KZ and hands stay comfortable.
Looks like you have already given this a lot of thought. Have you tested the out put of your current system, as to max rated out put? Is it making the 19 Amps? If you haven't already, the old wiring and connections can cause resistance, loosing some of the out put. Common on these older bikes. While converting, you may want to re-wire as well, ensuring the system is operating correctly. An Amp meter, either a clamp on, or in-line, will show if the system out put is correct. It will also show if the total usage is higher than the out put of the charging system. Just move the clamp, or the in-line meter to measure load or out put.

Whats the fuel pressure control that uses current? Is this adjustable? Got a Link to it?
1982 KZ1000LTD K2 Vance & Hines 4-1 ACCEL COILS Added Vetter fairing & Bags. FOX Racing rear Shocks, Braced Swing-arm, Fork Brace, Progressive Fork Springs RT Gold Emulators, APE Valve Springs, 1166 Big Bore kit, RS34's, GPZ cams.
1980 KZ550LTD C1 Stock SOLD Miss it
1979 MAZDA RX7 in the works, 13B...

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KZ1000P charging system output? 11 Jan 2013 12:37 #566847

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Motor Head wrote: I see your in Florida, so (1) heated gloves wouldn't be needed much if at all. Looks like a nice fairing on the front, which would (2) almost eliminate any wind on the hands. I have a Vetter on my KZ and hands stay comfortable.
Looks like you have already given this a lot of thought. (3) Have you tested the out put of your current system, as to max rated out put? Is it making the 19 Amps? If you haven't already, the old wiring and connections can cause resistance, loosing some of the out put. Common on these older bikes. While converting, (4) you may want to re-wire as well, ensuring the system is operating correctly. An Amp meter, either a clamp on, or in-line, will show if the system out put is correct. It will also show if the total usage is higher than the out put of the charging system. Just move the clamp, or the in-line meter to measure load or out put.

(5) Whats the fuel pressure control that uses current? Is this adjustable? Got a Link to it?

1. A common misconception. Did you know I had snow on my beloved GS a couple of years ago? It gets into the teens here in the winter.
2. The Windjammer is a great fairing, but does not block cold air on the fingers.
3. Hard to do with the motor sitting next to the bike (it's getting an 1100cc conversion "while I'm at it"). :) I have another GS1000 with the same regulator on it and it shows about 8 amps when an inductive meter is placed around the battery cable. I have no idea if this is accurate and plan to buy a load tester to get a better reading.
4. Check this out, it's a Bussmann 15303 ATM fuse and relay panel:


5. I'm building my own. It will use a 0-100 PSI / .5-4.5V sensor on the fuel rail that will be read by an Arduino Uno micro controller, which outputs through an N-channel transistor to control the fuel pump via pulse width modulation (PWM). It is adjustable via programming. If I put some more time into it, I'm sure I could figure out a pair of up/down buttons. No link as yet as it remains untested, I just soldered the last part of it yesterday. There is a fellow here that will sell you a similar device for $50 that is adjustable. It may take a few days for him to get in touch with you, by the time he did I had already figured it out and started on the Arduino.
1981 Suzuki GS1000G

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KZ1000P charging system output? 11 Jan 2013 15:33 #566872

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For reliable electrical connections, I use these types of tools:

Wire Terminal Crimping Tools
www.pbase.com/mainecruising/wire_termination (The Good, Bad, & Ugly of Crimpers))
crimpsupply.com/


If you're doing splicing(joining wires together), try these, as they are moisure resistant:

Sherco Auto parts
NiAc ™ Heat Shrink Butt Connectors. The splices are first crimped, and then shrunk down.
Adhesive Lined—Moisture Proof Low Temp. Cross-Linked Ionic Polymer.
10 Pack 100 Pack 1000 Pack
HSNRBS 22-18 Gauge Red NiAc™ $3.50 $24.95 $174.95
HSNBBS 16-14 Gauge Blue NiAc™ $3.50 $24.95 $174.95
HSNYBS 12-10 Gauge Yellow NiAc™ $4.25 $ 39.95 $269.95

NiAc Assortment SBA-HSN
30 Red, 40 Blue, 30 Yellow
$29.95

Similar types can be found at most auto parts stores, made by 3M.



Wire Termination Insulation & Sizes

Terminal Insulation Color Wire Sizes
RED
22-18 gauge wire
BLUE
16-14 gauge wire
YELLOW
12-10 gauge wire
RED
8 Gauge
1982 GPZ1100 B2
General Dynamics/Convair 1983-1993
GLCM BGM-109 Tomahawk, AGM-129A Advanced Cruise Missile (ACM)

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KZ1000P charging system output? 11 Jan 2013 22:01 #566913

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Thanks, but I'm using Weatherpack connectors for all but the OEM fuse box connector (recycled it with new wire and terminals) so it will plug in in the event it needs future maintenance.

I shop online (Waytek, Mouser, PCS, etc.) for electrical pieces such as these since parts stores tend to have high prices and/or don't carry what I need. I buy striped PVC (low temp) wire from British Wiring and solid color SXL/TXL (high temp) wire from Motorsports Wiring.
1981 Suzuki GS1000G

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