TOPIC:

Okay,,, I can get the circlips in with the piston out but my hands are too large or I am too weak to work them in with the piston installed,,, plus the studs are in the way.
I don't feel like losing one ( worse losing it in the engine even though I have rags covering ) so wondering if any of you know of a tool that will work on this engine.

KTM and Pit Posse have a tool but are coy when offering information on fitment. Thanks.

Guess my question is answered....

I am also having the same problem as you with the circlips.
If any one could chime in it sure would help out.
I know my 1983 GPZ-1100 uses an 18mm circlip but don't know if that is all all I need to consider when getting one of these Install Tool.

I have never used anything other than a quality pair of small needle nose pliers followed by a small pick to rotate the clip to be sure it is seated in the groove. I also used the precautionary towels to seal any possible entry into the depths of the crankcase during a fumble.(about a 50% chance for me) #2 and #3 are a long reach, especially with the cylinder studs in the way, but it helps to do them first at the top of their travel, then rotate the engine to do #1 and #4.

I'm sure a special tool exists, but I never used one at the factory or was aware of one?

Mike

I use my fingers and a small (tiny) blade screwdriver to press the clip into the groove.

hardrockminer wrote: I use my fingers and a small (tiny) blade screwdriver to press the clip into the groove.

That's pretty much what this first timer did too..... I was worried about one going flying too but didn't have a problem

krazee1 wrote: I have never used anything other than a quality pair of small needle nose pliers followed by a small pick to rotate the clip to be sure it is seated in the groove. I also used the precautionary towels to seal any possible entry into the depths of the crankcase during a fumble.(about a 50% chance for me) #2 and #3 are a long reach, especially with the cylinder studs in the way, but it helps to do them first at the top of their travel, then rotate the engine to do #1 and #4.

I'm sure a special tool exists, but I never used one at the factory or was aware of one?


Mike

Yes and made sure you lightly file down any nicks you put in piston

Sorry, not understanding the nick in the piston? I may have launched a circlip or two in my time, but I'm not enough of a klutz to damage a piston installing a wrist pin clip!
(I've had a bit of practice)
Confused, Mike

I got a cir-clip story! I know nothing about WTF happened? I bought a bike and the 1075 engine was extra parts. Goof ball Guy tells me, Oh Ya' , new Wiseco 1075 kit, I bent a valve. So he had FBG build him an engine.
So, I take it apart. And find a trashed, rolled oil ring with circlips scoring the liner! That was his bent valve ! Lost compression. Cause of 2 gouges up and down the wall! ??? At least the head was still like new. So I put a new liner in and bored the 1 hole, bought a new Wiseco. and said F the cir-clips. I am using teflon buttons. .234" thickness. I had to take .016" of of the Wiseco wrist pins. I am actually selling this engine on ebay for $1000. I think the said he rode it for 2 miles. So this block has 2 miles on 3 pistons, with 1 new one.
I was at the shop today, slightly cleaning up some early Z1 fork lowers to sell also. Can't shine them too much. Going to clear them like OEM. The Caged Heat is hibernating. Face ass book kicked me off! GOOD! Now I won't waste time. And I can turn that into shop time!
Moral of the story is!
Pay The Man! Sometimes, if your not sure! I always hated cir-clips! I would put a dowel rod thru, slide cir-clip over it. Loose, I have a 17mm in this crank for checking all 4 rods for straightness.
Ebay is a whole new story! They are stopping me end of January for not complying with their new money management system! I am private, no business, no EIN or Tax I.D. #'s They want my Social Security #
I don't think so Bob! Sorry to babble. But it was a good day! I even switched a set of 76 LTD dual brakes around to back and made some short lines to hook to the braided hoses. Of course I have pics!

FWIW.... Here is how I ended up installing cir clips. Did #2 & #3 first. Then 1&4. Install first clip on piston on the bench in a way that the 2nd clip to install is facing outwards (to the side) to make it easier to get to between the studs. Start the clip in the detente and work around as far as you can get.

Then, holding what you got,,, take a flat tip screwdriver,,, I used an 8 inch with a 1/4 tip,,, slip it underneath between the clip and piston and twist the screwdriver counter clockwise to where the clip slips into the hole. Then with a small screwdriver home the clip into its place.

Now getting the cir clip positioned correctly once installed took some time. Tapped it around with a small screwdriver and small ball peen hammer.

I practiced on the bench a couple of times first with old clips. Then installed all 4 in less than 20 minutes. Ensure you have the holes blocked as you don't want an uncooperative cir clip falling in to the crankcase. .

As for installing the cylinder wall, the worm clamps did not work for me. Had to ease the pistons in (2 & 3 first). SERIOUS attention required here as the rings will slip out of the grooves and you could break one. This took about 2 hours of fiddling.

I could find no tool small enough. Pit Posse made a small 12mm which might have worked??? but they no longer make it. They make them for the racers and large engines where the clips can both be easily installed on the bench. Then after the piston is easily pushed in the cylinder (many tools on market for this), the rod and cap can be easily installed from underneath. But you are on your own with a motorcycle with pressed on rods.

I was pretty spoiled at the factory having the proper ring compressors, but had to do a few by hand. As you said #2&3 up, get the rings started into the cylinder and then rotate the crankshaft to do #1&4. Very important to have a good leade or chamfer on the bottom of the cylinder liners. I remember installing a big bore kit cylinder for a buddy where the chamfer was mostly machined away, and it was a PITFA to install, that one took 4 hands and a lot of patience.

z1Kzonly's picture shows why it is so important to be damn sure the circlip is properly seated in the groove!

Mike

In regards to the OP's question about a cir-clip tool, I searched high and low for one when I rebuilt the top end in my KZ. No one and I mean no one had anything for this application. Had I been installing the factory cir-clips it probably wouldn't have been near as difficult as installing the ones that came with the piston kit. They are mega-heavy duty clips. Several places I contacted gave me their advice for installing the clips but when I told them about the difference between stock clips and the ones that came with the pistons most said "Good Luck". So at the time I was giving serious thought to just installing the OEM clips and hope for the best, which looking back on it I should have tried, but I didn't. I wanted to use the clips that came with the kit. Now if you do one engine every so often I suppose you can develop a knack for installing the clips, but that wasn't my case. So I continued my search for a tool thinking someone in this great country of ours must have been down this road before.

I finally ran across a place called Stomski Racing and they specialize in working on Porsche automobiles. They make a clr-clip installation tool that looked small enough to get between the engine studs and pistons while installing the cir-clips, but they didn't make it in the proper size for the KZ-1000 cir-clips. So on a lark I called Stomski and explained my situation and wondered if he could make a tool to fit the KZ-1000 clip? While I wouldn't say the owner jumped on the request to make a one-off tool for me, he agreed to do one up. The owner made up a correct size tool in about 2 days and sent it to me right quick. However, it wasn't cheap. I think the tool cost me $80 or $90, but I felt it was worth it to help me put those darn clips in. Since I purchased the tool I have used it two more times on other engines for guys and it works well as long as you follow instructions and check your work after installing the clip. I will add that even with the tool you must cover all openings to the engine case as clips will fly out of the tool if you aren't careful and lucky, but it still isn't the easiest job, especially when the engine is in the bike.

I had given thought to running "buttons" on the wrist pins, but they can have problems too so I stayed with the clips. I believe there are some other Kawasaki wrist pin clips available ( Kawasaki #92033-1054 ) that are stronger than the stock ones, but not near as strong as the ones that came with the piston kit I used. I later thought about this situation and don't know why I didn't just run the stock clips which are much easier to install. There really is no load on them to speak of and as long as they clip in the grove and keep the wrist pin in place they will no doubt work fine. If you go to You Tube and look up Stomski Racing you will see a video about his cir-clip tool.

Rick H.