Welcome, Guest
Username: Password: Remember me

TOPIC:

Worth the money to repair? please help 02 Sep 2014 18:58 #646041

  • 650ed
  • 650ed's Avatar
  • Offline
  • User
  • Posts: 15344
  • Thank you received: 2828
Lot's of folks really do have problems tuning for pods. I believe it has a lot to do with what particular model bike and carbs they have and to a large extent the amount of mechanical skill, time, and to some extent luck they have. As far as pods improving power - I suspect a lot of ""improvement" comes from spending considerable time and effort tuning the bike which may not have been properly tuned when the airbox was on. That would certainly make the bike run better, although it's possible in many cases the same could have been accomplished by spending time tuning the bike with the airbox on. I find it interesting that when a full blown effort with dyno testing was performed by Cycle World comparing pods to the stock airbox there was no overall power improvement on the stock bikes tested, and I have not seen any dyno sheets that show pods increasing power across the powerband over the stock HP on an unmodified engine. This is consistent with the findings of the Mikuni engineers who designed the airboxes for bikes with Mikuni carbs (image below). Of course, if the engine has been modified the results may be different. Ed

1977 KZ650-C1 Original Owner - Stock (with additional invisible FIAMM horn)
The following user(s) said Thank You: kaw-a-holic

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Worth the money to repair? please help 03 Sep 2014 13:46 #646132

  • MDZ1rider
  • MDZ1rider's Avatar
  • Offline
  • User
  • Posts: 381
  • Thank you received: 118
Two points...
When you take a bike to a professional mechanic for a diagnosis and estimate, don't offer your opinion. You steered him towards a potentially bad rod bearing by saying that's what you thought it was, That's probably one of the most costly jobs he can quote. He's not going to argue if you tell him you think that noise is a big wad of cash going from your hands to his pocket. I'm not saying you have a dishonest mechanic. I'm saying he's human. If it's a free estimate, you get what you pay for. You'd be better off paying an hours diagnostic labor and just saying "it's got a knock". It may be something simple. Let the mechanic find out.
Second...A bike with a loud knock is worth about the same as a bike with it's engine in a box. Either way, it's going to be a "project" bike. You have nothing to loose by trying it yourself. The outcome is A)you're successful B) You end up selling it as a project bike for about the same value. C) You pay a mechanic the same cost as the full job to put it back together. Get a manual and go for it!
The following user(s) said Thank You: PLUMMEN

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Last edit: by MDZ1rider. Reason: Correct a typo

Worth the money to repair? please help 03 Sep 2014 16:44 #646146

  • cafebrat
  • cafebrat's Avatar Topic Author
  • Offline
  • User
  • Posts: 82
  • Thank you received: 4
I spoke with the mechanic today on the phone to see if he had any diagnosis for me on the knock. He said he didn't hear anything he considers knock or tick. He said it seemed fine when he rode it and fine sitting idling. So convinced he just wasn't hearing what I was talking about I stopped by the shop on my way home from work. He was hearing just fine, but he said he doesn't think it's anything. Just the noise the engine makes. We sat there listening to it and talking for a while and threw quite of bit off the table of things we knew it definatly wasnt. He mentioned the slim to none chance of it actualy being my rod bearing because they're the roller bearings in this model. And like I previously did, we both checked for air/exhaust leaks again. Valves are all in clearance. So we decided we'd pull the cover off an get into the flywheel, stator and see how things look. I left him with that and they were looking to close up shop by that time. So we'll see! After that I'm going to take his advice and just try and accept the idea for a couple rides that maybe its normal? Luckily he didn't just dive into it and hit me with a massive invoice. He was actually ready to send me riding off into the sunset today with a "your all good"
83 Kawasaki Kz1100 LTD
81 Honda cm400
72 Suzuki T500 Titan** 2-stroke B)

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Worth the money to repair? please help 11 Sep 2014 18:45 #647179

  • saxjonz
  • saxjonz's Avatar
  • Offline
  • User
  • KawboyZ
  • Posts: 2182
  • Thank you received: 75
At this point the word hypochondriac comes to mind... :woohoo:

cafebrat wrote: I spoke with the mechanic today on the phone to see if he had any diagnosis for me on the knock. He said he didn't hear anything he considers knock or tick. He said it seemed fine when he rode it and fine sitting idling. So convinced he just wasn't hearing what I was talking about I stopped by the shop on my way home from work. He was hearing just fine, but he said he doesn't think it's anything. Just the noise the engine makes. We sat there listening to it and talking for a while and threw quite of bit off the table of things we knew it definatly wasnt. He mentioned the slim to none chance of it actualy being my rod bearing because they're the roller bearings in this model. And like I previously did, we both checked for air/exhaust leaks again. Valves are all in clearance. So we decided we'd pull the cover off an get into the flywheel, stator and see how things look. I left him with that and they were looking to close up shop by that time. So we'll see! After that I'm going to take his advice and just try and accept the idea for a couple rides that maybe its normal? Luckily he didn't just dive into it and hit me with a massive invoice. He was actually ready to send me riding off into the sunset today with a "your all good"

79 LTD B3
80 LTD B4 1075 kit JE Pistons .410 cam grind, Bassani, 31 keihin CR Specials...
1980 Z1R, 2002 ZRX1200, 2003 ZRX1200

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Worth the money to repair? please help 27 Nov 2014 12:48 #654786

  • Dplus75
  • Dplus75's Avatar
  • Offline
  • User
  • Posts: 1
  • Thank you received: 0
Hello Everyone!
I hope this thread is still active. I'm having a similar issue bottom end knocking with a lost of power. While a little uncertain if I want to try to rebuild it myself, the posts here have given me lots of encouragement. I've purchased a shop manual, gasket set, wrist pins and I figured do the rings and valves if I'm going to open it up. My question: what could be wrong with the crank? Most of my local friends think it's the bearings but the posts here lead me to believe that is probably not the case. Would it be worth buying another crank?

BTW I ride a '78 KZ1000
Yours,
D
Devin Allen
1978 KZ1000

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Worth the money to repair? please help 27 Nov 2014 13:51 #654791

  • SWest
  • SWest's Avatar
  • Offline
  • Sustaining Member
  • 10 22 2014
  • Posts: 22347
  • Thank you received: 2599
If it's a permanent magnet rotor they are notorious for the casting separating from the spindle. That would make a knocking sound. It would get worse over time. I have two spares and buy them when they are cheap. In the late 70's one was so loose it froze to the alternator winding's. Man did I have a hard time getting the cover off without damaging the housing but I did. Ran it battery only until I found another. Back then the Z1 parts were like gold. Pull the Alt. cover and look for a crack/space around the spindle. Also put the cover back on and see if the noise is gone, if so, THERE IT IS!
I noticed the bike had more low end power with the rotor gone. I've thought about having a switch to turn off the alt. when racing. Might try it some day.
Steve

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Worth the money to repair? please help 27 Nov 2014 18:43 #654806

  • 80B4
  • 80B4's Avatar
  • Offline
  • User
  • Posts: 447
  • Thank you received: 105
These old engines are not quiet while running, even if they are in great shape. New liquid cooled motorcycles like my YZF600 are almost silent while running.
If you don't see any metal in the filter or on the drain plug when changing the oil, your mechanic is probably correct. Ride it and have fun!
1980B4 1000
1978 Z1R
1978 B3 750

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Worth the money to repair? please help 28 Nov 2014 04:37 #654817

  • nads.com
  • nads.com's Avatar
  • Offline
  • User
  • Posts: 1000
  • Thank you received: 20
when using the hose to locate sound, once a very loud noise is located near or on a moving part,
u have to scan the immediate area too. I know for a fact if u put the hose in front of the block,
right by the first rod and hear a loud noise and it gets louder as u move the hose toward the stator that
Its not your rod. And yes they can knock and my very same rod did at mid high rpm. Never
underestimate the power of the hose. just sling it around a bit and it'll pick up something. :woohoo:

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Last edit: by nads.com.

Worth the money to repair? please help 28 Nov 2014 06:19 #654821

  • SWest
  • SWest's Avatar
  • Offline
  • Sustaining Member
  • 10 22 2014
  • Posts: 22347
  • Thank you received: 2599

LineArtist wrote: The original air box is the key to getting these good old bikes running good (even with a V&H exhaust). I don't know enough about pods but I certainly read plenty about endless hours of wrenching and trying all sorts of jet configurations. And why is that necessary, does the HP jump into the 100's, does it get better MPG - hellz no. It's just looks different (cool to some). The base fact is the air box supplies all the necessary air for a stock engine. If you spent 1000's on your engine then maybe a top end pod setup will be a compliment. However at that point you may as well go for the turbo and nitros setup, beef up the suspension, brakes, wheels and clip the handlebars right onto the fork, head between your knees.

I better stop, think my point is made.


Like I said in another thread. Pods are open to the environment. High speeds create a vortex between your knees and can starve the carbs. A strong side wind (like we get out here) can cause problems too. The air box is in the frame and is pressurized at speed (as long as the side covers are on) and is in a stable environment. I don't care how cool they look, if they don't work, they just flat don't work.
My three cents
Steve

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Powered by Kunena Forum